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Short Sea Shipping

December 17, 2003 Talking Freight Seminar Series Transcript

Operator:

Thank you for joining us. If you have a question at any time, please press 1 on your touchtone phone. At the end of the q&a session your line will be briefly accessed to obtain the conference. As a reminder the conference is being recorded today wednesday, december 17, 2003. I would now like to turn the conference over to Jennifer Seplow. Please go ahead, ma'am.

J. Seplow:

Good afternoon, thank you, everybody, good morning to you on the web. Welcome to the 6th seminar in the talking freight series. My name is Jennifer Seplow and I will moderate today's seminar. Today's seminar will focus on short sea shipping. Please be advised that today's seminar will be recorded. I will spend some time going over the overview and introduction for those who have not participated in talking freight before. Then will -- we will wait until 1:00. Today we have two speakers, Carl Sobremisana and Mark Yonge. Mr. Yonge began in Jacksonville, Florida, in the marine transportation industry. He then joined the new division of sea land service incorporated in New Jersey as Marketing Manager and eventually vice president, general manager, targeting this company which generated and operated cargo vessels transports modular homes and cargo vessels worldwide. He later founded a new company specializing in the transport of project vessels and later found two new EUro flag vessel operating companies which provided container and intra-coastal -- intermodal services. Much of Mr. Yonge's service -- has been with short sea and new short sea shipping program known as scoop. He provides consulting service to the U.S. Department of Transportation, maritime administration, MARAD, consulting to Seabridge Ferries, a new short sea shipping company, startup development, Marketing research, funding presentations, government and energy relations, contract negotiations, labor relations and environmental issues. Carl Sobremisana is a project manager dealing with a variety of national issues, court safety and security, technology development and short sea shipping. One of the most important responsibilities he has now is serving on the MARAD group formulating plans and MARAD short sea shipping initiative for coast wife -- coast wise shipping between Canada and Mexico. He is a former urban planner with the New York City development and involved in the redevelopment of the waterfront plan. He serves as a planning board chairman in New Jersey and task force on New York City and New Jersey fisheries development. Mr. Sobremisana has served on national projects with the national academy of sciences dealing with maritime and technology issues, he serves on the research board of international and transportation trade. He has served on two national review teams after 9/11. In the international field as a member of the east west center at the University of Hawaii he co-authored a book and paper for environmental guidelines on ports in Asia and urban waterfront revitalization for the Permanent International Association of Navigation Congresses (PIANC). He managed port training seminars, research and development for American states. He served on two White House nation building and humanitarian aid projects in Haiti, Honduras, and Nicaragua. He recently received a "Bronze Medal" by the Maritime Administration for leading a port damage assessment team in Honduras and Nicaragua after Hurricane Mitch.

The presentations for this seminar are available on the FHWA Office of Freight Management web site. I will send out the web address in a seminar follow up email.

I'd like to go over a few logistical details prior to starting the seminar. Today's seminar will last 90 minutes, with 60 minutes allocated for the speakers, and the final 30 minutes for audience Question and Answer. The Operator will give you instructions on how to ask a question over the phone during the Q&A period. However, if during the presentations you think of a question, you can type it into the smaller text box underneath the chat area on the lower right side of your screen. Please make sure you are typing in the thin text box and not the large white area. Presenters will be unable to answer your questions during their presentations, but I will use some of the questions typed into the chat box to start off the question and answer session in the last half hour of the seminar. Those questions that are not answered will be posted to the Freight Planning LISTSERV, which will be discussed momentarily. If at anytime you would like to zoom in on the slide that is showing on your screen, you can click on the zoom icon at the top of your screen.

Finally, I would like to remind you that this session is being recorded. A file containing the audio and the visual portion of this seminar will be posted to the Talking Freight Web site in the next day or so. To access the recorded seminar, please visit Talkingfreight.webex.com and click on the "recorded events" link on the left side of the page and then choose the session you'd like to view. Due to the size of the file, recorded files are available for viewing/listening purposes only and cannot be saved to your own computer. We encourage you to direct others in your office who may have not been able to attend this seminar to access the recorded seminar.

Let's see what time it is. We have just about 1:00, so wait a few more minutes for a few others to join us, then we will start with Carl Sobremisana and his presentation on Short Sea Shipping Initiatives. If you can hang on for just a few minutes, we will then begin.

Ladies and gentlemen, please continue to stand by your Short Sea Shipping call will begin shortly. As a reminder to quEUe up, during the presentation, your line will be briefly accessed from the conference to obtain information. Once again, please continue to stand by and thank you for your patience.

Good afternoon, everybody, we will now be starting with Carl Sobremisana and his presentation on Short Sea Shipping Initiatives.

Carl Sobremisana:

Thank you, Jennifer. This is Carl Sobremisana. I really deem this a great honor to be presenting this presentation on short sea shipping on behalf of the maritime administration as well as my colleagues within the maritime administration. The presentation this morning is a brand new initiative that the maritime administration has been engaged in for approximately a year, a little over a year. I will like -- I would like to give you an overview of what I will be presenting, introduction and description of short sea shipping initiative. Introduction and Description of Maritime Administration (MARAD) and Short Sea Shipping (SSS) Initiative, Lessons Learned from European SSS, Overview of U.S. Waterway System, Needs and Activities of SSS, Challenges and Accomplishments, Conclusions and Recommendations.

The mission of the Maritime Administration goes back to the 1920 act. That act basically gave the mandate for this country to have an able merchant marine. MARAD, as its primary position, is to promote the maritime fleet as well as U.S. ports in the United States. One of the major programs is national defense. We maintain a ready reserve fleet on all the deep water coasts of the United States. We served our country in terms of support to the U.S. Navy during Iraqi Freedom and during the gulf war. We also provide financial support with our Title XI loan guarantee program for building of U.S. shipping in the United States. We also provide technical assistance and research, and we have offices distributed throughout the United States in New York, Norfolk, national hurricane center -- New Orleans, branches in Seattle as well as in St. Louis. A little bit of a history of the short sea shipping, it is not something that is new, it goes back to biblical times, in fact. 1200 b.c., the Phoenicians were originators in the Mediterranean Sea in approximately 1600 a.d. along the coast of the United States. This is a working definition of the U.S. department of transportation, MARAD, currently. Short sea shipping is defined as commercial waterborne that does not transit an ocean, utilizes inland, coastal waterways to move commercial freight off already congested highways there buy providing more efficient and favor roadways for cars while alleviating congestion at critical choke points. A secondary effect of short sea shipping would be reduction of air pollution in the overall fuel consumption to economies of scale. Without building more highways, short sea shipping can provide additional capacity with the national transportation system with a greater use of waterborne carriage and can enhance acknowledges to our north, and south American trading partners. Here we have some lessons learned from northern Europe. These are major elements that they have experienced. Short sea shipping is strong and growing, reducing a lot of road congestion, as well as he economizes fuel and reduces pollution. Their experience has also shown that you need viable services that are reliable, a high frequency of service, short transit time, imaginative infrastructure. Here is a slide that we received recently from the port of Rotterdam, the port of Rotterdam served approximately 350 million people within an 800 mile radius. That is the top circular concentric line. The next one is 220 million at 600 miles along with the last circle which deals with 300 miles that covers 1606 million people. There are 8 approximately -- there are 15 European countries that participate in the short sea shipping program. And we are basically involved with conversations with people in Rotterdam as well as other locations in Europe. Here is a listing of the innerland connections that basically are connecting inland shipping, road, rail, pipeline and short sea feeder services. There are major factors for short sea shipping being successful in Europe. One of them is geography. The proximity of the countries to the waterway system in the balance particular as well as -- Baltic in the North Sea as well as in the Mediterranean. Another is the laws that exist that have multijurisdictional planning and programming which provides not only policies for the 15 countries but also provides subsidies. And finally they have an inefficient rail system, which effectively is run by each country, so there is a lack of continuity in terms of infrastructure. Let me now turn to the -- U.S. waterway system. Here is a depiction of trade root -- routes in the United States. They basically fall into three categories. The lines going out to places like Hawaii, as well as Puerto Rico, and the western PACTific are what we call noncontinuous trade routes. The intra-coastal, and I will try to give you a better view of where I am talking about, since the map is somewhat small, I am going to use this cursor to show you the panama canal, the intra-coastal waterway or the intra-coastal waterway where you connect the east coast with the west coast with the panama canal is the second one and the second domestic coast wise trade is the activity that occurs along the Atlantic coast, the gulf of Mexico -- gulf coast and the west coast. Here is a depiction of the major gateways, both land as well as sea in the United States. If you will notice to the north, with the United States, particularly around the area of the Chicago Detroit area, this is a heavy transit area for tonnages of exports and imports, as well as contrasting that in terms of trucks, if you go directly southbound to New Orleans you see a large distribution pattern of tonnages that pass through the port of New Orleans. Let me give you some characteristics of United States waterway system. There are approximately 9,000 facilities that operate in the United States, both for deep water and inland, and about 350 major container or commercial cargo ports that operate in the United States as well. Here is a depiction of the waterway system transportation efficiency of waterway shipping, and particularly using barges and coast wise traffic. They transit, within the United States, 25,000 miles of inland and coastal waterways. The waterway connections are linked to 250,000 miles of rail, as well as 460,000 miles of approximately -- pipeline and 445,000 miles of interstate highways. You also can see that the efficiency of that -- not only low energy costs but also the fact that you can take many trucks off the highway. Here is a depiction of tons of the distance covered per cargoton with the same quantity of fuel. So in this particular case, a vessel can travel 370 miles on -- kill meters -- kilo meters, which is equal to 229 miles, rail is 300, and that is equal to 386 miles, and truck is 100 kilo meters, which is 62 miles here we have an example of a typical large operation at an existing port in the Port of Portland. You will notice the two barges of different sizes that are at the berthing area of the container crane. There are different types of barge operations, we call -- which are called push with tug boats, boat operations, that not only operate in deep sea waters but as well as our inland waterways. Here is another view with some containers that are stacked, typically 53 foot containers operate in the commercial area of the domestic trade, and 40-foot trailers operate on the international trade routes for the most part. Here is an example of a self - loading and unloading container vessel that operates in the Hawaii service. Obviously when you come to the different islands there, they don't have adequate container or offloading equipment, so this particular vessel provides both services. Let's turn now to short sea shipping and new development activities. The New York/New Jersey port inland distribution network is a brand new initiative at the regional level. I will go into a little more detail in the following slide. The next bullet -- bull it deals with the maritime research administration research at the University of New Orleans, that is a business plan that shows the viability of running a coast-wide service from the New York, port of New York/New Jersey into the New England area. The next bull it represents the state of Florida's intra-coastal and inland waterway. This is the first statewide study that looked at the water system to relieve congestion. If you note, I have left, I have given you the website to give you more details on their actual study. Finally, the gulf of Mexico, short sea shipping, immediately after our conference in New York in 2002 we had the experience of people down in the gulf area wanting to know more about short sea shipping, because there was basically an organization called the gulf of Mexico states accord and gulf of Mexico partnership that are essentially operating short sea operations and want to expand that to reduce the congestion that is on the U.S./Mexican border in terms of truck flows. Trailer bridge, which is one of our coastal carriers and operates between Jacksonville, port of Jacksonville and Puerto Rico, at a New York conference, listed several considerations if you wish to operate a successful short sea operation. Cost of origin, cost at destination, adopting a vessel to land rather than vice versa, as well as environmental safety and quality of life factors, and policy focus and incentives that would insure the success of the operation. Here is the Portland distribution . The genesis of this -- network. The genesis of this project start the -- started with the fact that the port of New York/New Jersey recognized that the -- cargo would not be met with land and needed a port. As a result they came up with a strategy that looked at primarily using barges as well as rail. As you can see within a 500-mile radius, there are approximately 12 satellite sites that they are looking at. The first one is port of Albany, right -- Albany, right here, went online in March 2003 which is moving containers from the port of ... and Newark to the port of Albany. The next port is port of bridge port, Connecticut, which is roughly in this area here. That will go online in roughly the spring of 2004. So the emphasis here is to relieve congestion but also to be able to facilitate the movement of containers, particularly, through the port. The average time for container that resides at the port, in a typical port, typically in New York, is approximately seven days. The efficiency of using barge operations could help mitigate that situation. Here is a typical vessel that operates with the sPACTe program that we have in the United States. This particular vessel carries the rockets that are used for the program at Cape -- Kennedy, this is in the state of mobile, Alabama, I'm sorry, the state of Alabama but passed through the port of mobile. And this has a dual function as a vessel. It not only carries the rocket, but it also has commercial cargo operations that transits the water -- waterways of the U.S. why the U.S. needs short sea shipping, well, the department obviously is very much concerned about congestion. Congestion increases for passage and freighter are protected in the future, air pollution increases in urban areas, really they are the target areas where short sea shipping may have its opportunities. Accidents increases as a result of surface truck and mixes with passengers, causing these safety issues, and then the economic growth lines on this fleet full of goods, especially in just in time delivery, it's even more important that the congestion issue be resolved as best we can. Finally, the existing infrastructure cannot handle the increases, because of the following characteristics that are indigenous to our special transportation system. One is that our system is truly not an integrated intermodal transportation system. The transportation system we have built is somewhat concentric and was designed primarily for highway movements of passages of freight. We have an aging infrastructure. The urban populations are increasing, particularly on the east coast and on the west coast, and transport nodes are really where the urban centers are located. Here we have projections made that we received from the federal highways administration that relate to the road and son acknowledges in the future. As you can see, the greatest growth is on the western states, and then in central and south United States in the year 2020, you have 89%, the east coast is 79%. Here is a delineation of the I dash 95 -- I-95 corridor. For your motion -- information, there are over 40 million people, probably the most densely located population in the world. We are specking global maritime trade to increase by 2020. 10,000 more trucks per day are projected on the I-95 corridor itself. The cost of expanding highway systems is quite significant, it's $32 million per lane mile and $100 million for a highway interchange. Now we are going to turn to the challenges that deal with short sea shipping. This is a map of the United States, in terms of the projections of growth and it looks like to me a person on the verge of cardiac arrest. This view is quite troublesome, and is obviously a concern to the department right now. This is a slide I received from the University of Texas which is from Dr. McCray. You can see the distribution of trucks moving east and west and north and south. I would like you to particularly take note of the area that deals around the Detroit, Chicago area, as well as flowing into buffalo, as well as the New York area. It really starts, the density factor really starts to increase roughly around salt lake, going east, and also from roughly down in Tennessee, Oklahoma City area, going up into the Chicago. This is sort of the intersection where north-south-east-west trade occur. In an after agreement, both the Blaine Washington, the Detroit, Michigan, Buffalo and New York are the heaviest traffic movements of cargo and truck movements. And then, when you look at it in terms of truck movements going into Chicago, it really is concentrated in this particular area, and going east. Here is another slide provided by the federal highways administration. If you look at the south here between Brownsville, Laredo, Texas and he will pass oh, which is in this area here, these are the Elpas, Texas these are the concentrations of truck flows from Mexico. Again, noticing a pattern, you will notice that the trucks are similarly absorbed in the state of Texas. Here are some other market challenges that were presented at our New York conference. One of the or several points were made concerning other considerations that need to be looked at, an frequency again one sailing per week was insufficient, container size, domestic Market favored bigger boxes, overweight containers, which is very common with foreign trade, we get a number of overweight containers that affect our highway infrastructure, and finally the trade and expense to and from port facilities are a concern. Now, here is another series of challenges that were reported by the maritime industry at the spring conference in 2003. One point that was made was the formation of partnerships between the trucking industry and the maritime industry, and fortunately, I am very happy to report that in the port of bridge port experience, that has actually occurred, that there is a trucking company working with the port of bridge port. The second point that was made was the implementation of the single bill of lading interface and sheer size distribution systems, there is an actual interest in trying to develop a much more efficient bill of lading service that brings in the intermodal aspect of transportation, and reliable trucking and container ocean action. That, again, very much a needed element, because of, for example, the just in time deliveries that are part of our every day experience in transportation. And finally, the structure in implementing a low cost ship to operating crew compliment-- complement. The additional challenges that were mentioned were the federal highway maintenance tax and Mark Yonge will be making an additional presentation. Additional concerns were stevedoring costs, termination as well as terminal facilities, Jones Act was cited as high cost of ships and crews, and ship financing challenges, the fact that private investors need to have some insurance that their investment will have a better chance of success, so that in this particular case, and actually in the case of the port of New York/New Jersey, there are some mitigating factors, which is the fact that the port authority, as well as the state of Connecticut, are involved with pop ten developing a financial scheme to help offset some of the financial risk. Here is another representation of the map presented at the New York conference, short sea shipping, shows in the case of transit time and distance, that was 1144 miles which took 2.5 days between Los Angeles and Seattle, and then from Seattle to Oakland, it was 807 miles, which took 1 day and 16 hours. What are the accomplishments today? Realize that the maritime administration does not have an official program for short sea shipping, in fact, that is one of the tasks that I am involved with as the secretary to the maritime task force on short sea shipping, we are working together on putting together a program and working in concert with this industry but our accomplishments to today and where we really got started with this was the New York city conferences as I mentioned before in New York city in 2002, subsequently the formation of the short sea shipping task force by the maritime administration and the short sea shipping cooperative which Mark will go into more detail about. Mark's presentation will primarily focus on the Sarasota conference to bring short sea shipping people together in both public and private sectors to discuss opportunities for short sea shipping. The memorandum of cooperation with U.S., Canada and Mexico was signed at the Sarasota meeting, as well as the memorandum of cooperation with the Gulf of Mexico, states accord and the Gulf of Mexico States Partnership . After the Sarasota meeting we had interest expressed by the government of Korea in our short sea shipping initiative, and we have had opportunity to share information with the government of Korea, and particularly the organization that we have been working with is a university which has been given the research responsibilities for developing short sea shipping at the port of -- port of Incheon. The goal of this penta port seminar that we participated in was to look at a strategy to insure that insure that the port of Incheon could become a major transshipment port in northeast Asia. They basically have taken a 5 point approach. They want to develop a business port, an airport which was actually built in 2001, a satisfactory port, which they currently have but they want to expand to deeper location in the port of Incheon, technology port, they want to bring in companies from around the world, multi national corporations to bring in their technology as well as the development of their own Korean technology and finally what they call their tourist port or their leisure port, which would bring people to both Seoul as well as the port of incheon area. So we have been sharing information with them and maybe working with them in a cooperative program in the future. Conclusions? There is definitely a need for a national freight policy in the United States. There is a need to establish an intramodal freight policy that -- intermodal that integrates short sea shipping with the U.S. system. Educating departments at large, metropolitan planning organizations, s, railroads, truckers, the benefits of short sea shipping. Future initiatives, development of partnerships, as I indicated before, one is already started in the port of bridge port. We are hoping to see further paragraph north America ships develop at the federal and private sectors, state and local levels, strategic plan as well as the maritime administration strategic plan, and finally a -- the creation of a MARAD short sea shipping program within the department of trappings, which would be of an intermodal nature integrating highways and mass transportation, as well as other entities within the department because it is not a maritime activity it is really an intermodal activity. That concludes my presentation. If you need to know more about the short sea shipping operation and program that we have you can go to the website that is listed on the screen. Thank you very much.

J. Seplow

Thank you, Carl. Again, if anybody has any questions, they can post them to the chat area or you can save them for the last half hour of the seminar or you can send them to Carl directly. If you give me a few minutes or a few seconds here, I will set it up and we will move on to the next presentation.

Okay, Mark, you are now the presenter, so you are now going to Mark Yonge and his presentation on the annual short sea shipping. Mark, you can go ahead when you are ready.

Mark Yonge

Thank you, Jennifer. Good afternoon or good morning. I wish to thank the Federal Highways Administration and the Maritime Administration for inviting me to share with you some of my observations about the maritime administration second annual short sea shipping conference a tended in Sarasota, Florida. A mission statement set a goal to address the progress of short sea shipping initiative and address future strategies for the development of short sea shipping. Executives from industry and government were invited to present updates, opinions, concerns, and innovations from both the presenters panels and the very interactive conference participants. Part of the conference was set aside for three breakout sessions, conference attendees were assigned to three different work groups. Each comprising representatives from varied sectors of industry. Each work group was given a different category to address and asked to come up with a collaborative policy and strategy recommendations. Success in the conference and to short sea shipping, my opinion, requires the inside participation from all sectors of the transportation industry as well as the supply chain. Here is a partial list of industry sectors that attended the conference. Port authorities, we had shippers, fed federal, state and local government agencies. We had engineering and design firms, ship yards, vessel operating companies, associations, could s, cooperatives and transportation consultants. Approximately 200 executives attended the conference from both the United States and foreign countries. This slide shows you a little bit of points -- highlight points from the first day but captain bill Schubert, the administration of the United States maritime administration opened the conference with comments that really set the face -- PACTe and challenge to all of every one that attended. Captain Schubert stated the objectives and provided department insight on the focus of short sea shipping. He reported that a short sea shipping task force had been formed in MARAD and MARAD had accomplished forming a new public private cooperative, the short sea shipping cooperative nicknamed scoop. Captain Schubert -- pointed out that scoop provides a focused shipping think tank which MARAD needed badly. Other accomplishments, including the memorandum of cooperation signed by Canada and Mexico. Let me back up. The director of office of support in domestic shipping recapped some of the issues that should be addressed by the conference such as the harbor maintenance tax, which I will give you a few more details later in my talk, as well as federal support. As many of you know, federal support in the transportation industry has made forums such as Title XI loan guarantees for shipbuilding, construction subsidies, operating subsidies and use of capital construction fund deposits. He also brought up the point that there was an absolute need for the Market and freight analysis studies. He then provided additional updates and details about SCOOP MARAD task force and MARAD transportation system advisory council which many of you may recognize called MTSNAC. Reports to the secretary of transportation, a detail of the formation of the Gulf of Mexico states accord, commonly known as GOMSA. For those of you that may not be familiar with GOMSA, I will give you just a little bit of information here. GOMSA's objective of the accord is to establish working partnerships among six mention n and five U.S. states located in the U.S. gulf to promote economic and infrastructure development as well as educational and cultural exchanges. The court's mission statement goes on to say that it brings together public officials, entreprenEUrs, investors, scientists and educators from the 11 states in a collaborative effort aimed at enhancing the we will fair and quality of life of the citizens -- citizens of their respective communities and as a result benefiting the gulf of Mexico -community as a whole. The short sea memorandum between United States, Canada and Mexico are additional significant accomplishments by MARAD. These established a means of sharing, collaborating and cooperating with each other on short sea shipping technology, research, and research and development. It also provides for keeping so much other informed of policy decisions, directives and changes, each other's efforts to promote the concept of short sea shipping. It brings two countries or three countries that will be sharing so much trade. The short sea shipping co-op will be a proactive action co-op that intends to lead the charge to make short sea shipping an integral part of a seamless transportation system. Quickly reading for some of the scoop mission statements, scoop was formed to jointly address and promote innovations to improve transportation via short sea shipping, that in effect freight movement improvements utilizing short sea shipping research and development, to support introduction of short sea shipping programs that are consistent with national defense needs and to inform and educate all levels including corporate state, local and public, the need and acceptance and application of short sea shipping. Membership of scoop is open to all sectors of the supply train and transportation sectors, but membership is $1500 a year, nonvoting associate membership is $500 a year, and I really encourage every one to consider -- joining this very important cooperative. There's been a lot of talk over the years, and this is one group that is going to be an action group to make things happen. After Bob got through with his introduction, David McDonald, executive director of the port of manatee, Florida also chairman of the Port of Florida council, pointed out and proudly saw, not because I live here, but the state of Florida has already provided $1 billion to port improvements and also pointed out that Mexico is projected to be the number 1 trading partner of the United States in the next eight to ten years. The only panel -- addressed shippers concerns and asked the question why shippers use short sea shipping services. They moderated and the panelists were made up of ship operating companies, shippers and representatives of the I-95 Coalition. Here are some of the common points that developed from the paneled presentations and discussions which includes the audience. Obstacles to short sea shipping, becoming part of the transportation system, were pointed out. Obstacles such as port infrastructure, can they handle the cargo, are the ports proper for the various short sea vessels that will be used. What about the roads leading to and from the ports, can they handle the additional volumes? Are there ports that provide areas for cargo and what about back hauled traffic? One point mentioned frequently in the conference shippers are not engaged in short sea shipping at this point and there is a knit need to establish an outreach to shippers-- definite need. Short sea shipping service, right here a yes but look at some of the shippers needs, speed, price, flexibility, reliability is paramount. Note that shippers are not interested in experimentation. That can be a significant barrier or is a significant barrier, I should say, to new startups. Shippers clearly stated, what is in it for me? Shippers do not want to pay more, and they don't want greater risk. Really no surprises here. Some positive news came out. Shippers might consider longer transit times associated with water transport and shippers do view short sea shipping as a truck and rail multiplier. I would say that that is a clear indication that shippers are surely aware of the nation's growing highway congestion and limited capacity capability. That's a major concern for shippers, with their growing transportation needs. Next, address competitive short sea shipping vessels. This question comes from the requirement of the U.S. Jones Act that requires vessels trading between U.S. ports must be U.S. built, they have to be U.S. crewed, they have to be U.S. owned and have to be under U.S. control. U.S. shipbuilding costs are quoted as being as much as three times the cost to build a vessel in some other foreign countries. The panel was composed of a number of ship builders and ship operating companies and one ship operating company I should say that just took delivery on two new U.S. built vessels now trading on the U.S. west coast, on the bottom near ocean trailer express, two Newark particular class vessels-- new arctic class vessels. This is a requirement of the panel; most of them you can see can be completed by industry planning, industry cooperation and vessel designs. The major issue is government support through the Title XI loan guarantee program. New recommendations by the OMB, requiring 2 to 1 debt to equity ratios is generally agreed to be entirely too onerous on the industry especially when it requires innovation, new and designs as well as new operations, and new trade lanes that haven't been -- haven't even been proven and all of the many risks that are associated with new startups. Prior Title XI debt equity ratios is provided for up to 21.. so you can see that a 2 to 1 ratio requiring a shipment company to put up auto% of whatever the investment is, whether it is $100 million or $200 million or 50%, is quite a huge burden and certainly it is when you look at what the title of the program used to be before. Bottom line from this panel really provided a yes to the question, and provided a criteria that are needed to build competitive short sea vessels here in the United States. To address land-side infrastructure and labor. Panelists came from labor, government, port authorities and consultants, of particular interest, if you look on there, you will see that the international long shore mans union was there and this was the first appearance of long shore labor at short sea shipping meetings .. They committed to offering a competitive PACTkage which allows for an acknowledge waterway -- waterborne solution to our and -- dilemma and that short sea shipping opportunities new opportunities to the segment. That is a paraphrase from Mr. Gleason's statement but it is comforting and certainly listened to by every one in the transportation industry. Again, the importance of government was emphasized including support to fund startup operations and even provide two-years of funding to keep a new operation going. The Port of Rotterdam reported sub -- subsidizing one half of a new $350 million short sea shipping terminal in Rotterdam and emphasized the need for public, private and investment commitment. Florida reported investing $1 billion in port improvements. I have already established a new strategic intermodal initiative and they have developed a Florida transportation plan. The port and state governments, port authorities and state governments of New York and New Jersey committed $10 million of subsidy for the new port distribution network, service, barge service. That is referring to the two-years of funding that I mentioned earlier. It will be needed -- what will? Clearly government funding and commitment is a major component of what is going to be needed. Next panel addressed an international short sea shipping progress. As you can see here, there were panels from Canada, Mexico and the Netherlands. Short sea shipping initiative is very new, but Canada set out a plan as seen here. A number of lessons have been learned and were provided to the conference. Canada established a very proactive program by holding workshops across the country, initiating studies, putting up a short sea shipping website, all of these lessons were learned in new directions developed as their new -- short sea shipping initiative progresses. The Netherlands was the first country in Europe to promote short sea shipping which is -- has now grown to 40% of domestic cargo within the European union. Here we can see the accomplishments and lessons learned, many of which -- surface, have surfaced frequently in this conference. Government planning and roll. Creating awareness -- role, creating awareness, political awareness, involving shippers, even EU funding projects for 55 million Euros a year. The EU has recently replaced its funded program called PACT, pilot actions for combined transport, which gave incentives to what they call innovative solutions for combined transport, it was all included in their European transport policy and also in what they call a transEuropean networks. The PACT program ended in 2001 and there is a new program called Marco Polo which is intended to extend the scope of PACT to all services. Marco Polo motor ways of the sea in Europe, as they are referring to short sea shipping. The first call for Marco Polo proposals were due December 10, 2003, rewards, subsidies and funding are to be made by the summer of 2004. While there are many similarities in the EU and the United States, lessons that the EU have learned will be quite helpful. As pointed out by -- pointed out by the panelists the EU does not have the capabilities such as United States does, such as rail, trains, etc. Modeling of short sea shipping operations here in the United States is suggested by the panelists to be different from the EU's. In fact a suggestion was made that rail intermodal service is the most instructive transport model to -- of what users will expect of coastal services or short sea shipping. Key speaker from one of the luncheons was Mr. Emil Frankel, Assistant Secretary for Transportation Policy in the U.S. Department of Transportation. He addressed the conference and provided insight into the department's transportation on short sea shipping as alternative transportation capacity. He emphasized the DOT's policy of an integrated transportation system and that short sea shipping is a key element of future transportation capacity. It was important to hear him speak that a shipbuilding program has to be part of the plan, and he pointed out that states have a big part in the short sea shipping short sea shipping initiative. These are the policies and strategy recommendations that emerged from the three conference breakout groups. I call them collaborative policy recommendations. The first listed there is a government entitled loan guarantee program that will improve access. To meet construction and port startup costs. Back to the ship yard panel discussion, that new OMB 2 to 1 debt to equity recommendation ratio entitled on loan guarantees will hold back building of U.S.-flagged vessels. Additionally, the Title XI program also needs substantially more funding, authorizations to insight ship yard and renovations, ship yard upgrading -- upgrading and ship innovations as well as providing viable avenues for companies to build new vessels. The next one is open capital construction funds, deposits for building of new U.S. vessels. Presently capitalize construction funds are not eligible for the Jones day coastal trade. A quick explanation of the capital construction fund or CCF, is a program that encourages construction, recon -- reconstruction or acquisition of vessels through the deferment of federal income taxes on certain deposits of money or other property placed into a capital construction fund or CCF as it is called. The next one is exemption from a harbor short sea shipping freight from the harbor mug hug -- maintenance tax. This is a much discussed issue in many arenas. The harbor maintenance tax is a tax that is presently imposed on imported corridor, U.S. harbor maintenance tax or HMT or trust fund were implemented in 1977 to cover a portion of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers. The HMT is considered a significant barrier to the success of short sea shipping certainly is a barrier to any type of a domestic move and in many cases, domestic moves will be, probably be the majority of short sea shipping with the exception of the corridor movements coming from and to take NAFTA ports such as Mexico and Canada. The next one is the recommended U.S. government $5 million funding for freight flow infrastructure analysis, supply chain and identification. Not much explanation needed here. EU is doing it, Canada is doing it, U.S. needs to research and development funding for technology, development and deployment. Research and development funding is critical to innovation in vessel technology, critical for point of structure, critical for concepts and it's absolutely necessary to provide the funding to insight short see shipping operations. Awareness and outreach, education to elected officials, shippers, operators and the general public. Again these are almost textbook right out of the lessons learned by the EU and Canada, awareness of short sea shipping is -- as an alternative but also benefits of education to the public and environment, such as less traffic congestion, less highway s, less pollution. Additional transportation capacity needed to support a growing economy and so on. There are other significant events at the conference I would like to speak about, taking a look at the clock here. Formation of a short sea shipping traffic -- task force demonstrates conviction of MARAD to bring it to the next capability, as soon as possible. MARAD's formation of public private cooperative with a mission of action, the GOMSA, another example positive step forward as well as short sea shipping taking the old two heads better than one step further. Three countries developing, short sea shipping and sharing that knowledge for a common goal. Most importantly a positive statement from the department of transportation. Statements of conviction and commitment that sends a strong message to the private sector, short sea shipping will be a part of the nation's seamless integrated transportation system .

This demonstrated knowledge. Short sea shipping has progressed, short sea shipping presents all the participants a greater in depth detail of the challenges facing today's questions, and input produce sometimes critical interaction input that contributed to the conferences success, and achieving and surpassing, in my opinion, the conference's mission statement. Going beyond just the conference, I have some suggestions here I would like to make. In my opinion, an order for -- in order for short sea shipping to move forward become an able solution in taking a quote from ... speech at the conference of Rotterdam, not a modal shift but a mentality shift. I believe success will depend on all modes to work together with these mentality shifts to move forward. Thinking that transportation goes directly to the heart of our economy and our national security. Without adequate capacity, both are in did I. The nation's highway congestion and capacity problem will not fix itself. Short sea shipping offers a viable alternative, the sea and the waterways are there and waiting. Very important in the governance with all of us and with the trucking industry and the rail industry and all of the supply chain, short sea shipping is not a maritime issue, it is a transportation issue. Again, a change in mentality, approach solving our transportation and congestion and capacity problems is a team effort. The next one is keeping -- keep in mind short sea shipping must be viewed as new highway or transportation alternatives, not as a competitor to trucks and rail and must be integrated and into the nation's seamless transportation system as an equal to all modes of transportation. That's a paraphrase from a recent article from one of the representatives from the Netherlands. And last, going back to government state and federal must take the lead to make it happen. I leave you this thought that government spends -- first off, the economy and the national security are at stake. Those are big issues. Government spent billions of dollars each year maintaining existing highways, building new highways are projected to cost $33 million per lane mile and $100 million for highway interchange. Five or ten miles of highway building costs would get ships built, create new jobs, add transportation capacity, save -- safeguard our economic growth, safeguard our national security and even produce new tax revenues. I have included some contact information of which I encourage all sectors of transportation and the supply team to please become active, action numbers. I also put up a slide here, as a web links for additional reference. You will see there the -- some of them talk about the -- Europe, European commission, and some of the lessons they have learned and so on. Going down the line, you have information from Transport Canada, you have the news mac website and so on. Because I would like to share with you that I have always had a passion for the transportation industry, I am a firm believer in the need for strong U.S. merchant marine, strong U.S. merchant fleet and a strong U.S. ship yard capability. Short sea shipping can and will preserve that need, and I feel quite fortunate to be a part of this exciting new area. Thank you for your time and the opportunity to share my observation and per -- presentation at this conference on short sea shipping. I will be glad to answer any questions you may have.

J. Seplow:

Thank you, Mark. I hope everybody found these two presentations interesting. Some people have typed some questions in. Mark, you may not actually be seeing these questions. It looks like they were sent to me. I will go ahead and start off with some of the questions, if you just give me a second. We will start off with some questions that have been typed in. Let's see here. Actually, I am going to go back and put Mark's slide up on the website for a little while so people can write those down if they would like to again. This presentation is available on the FHWA freight website, I will put up the link and the recording as well. We will start off here, a question for Carl. Carl, can you address the specific differences in cabotage laws and subsidies that are applicable in Europe. Also looks like we have the differences in U.S. and Europe in these laws and subsidies.

C. Sobremisana:

I can only sort of give you some general information. My understanding is that the cabotage laws in Europe are basically the allowance of the 15 member nations allowing their fleets to traverse each one of their countries. There is no requirement, as I understand it for shipbuilding to be to be prevalent in one country. Crews which can originate in Netherlands can traverse other countries.

J. Seplow:

Thank you. This is actually for both speakers, if -- and I guess we could let Mark start off first. What specific recommendations do you have for small ports and the sphere of influence of nearby megaports to promote short sea shipping with the small port. Similarly what can an MPO representing a small port do to promote short sea shipping. How does MARAD's SSS program fit into the West Coast Transportation System Coalition efforts? Mark, I think we will start with you.

M. Yonge

I will let the MARAD question go to Carl. What would be required of the ports with small port?

J. Seplow

Right. To promote short sea shipping with the smaller port.

M. Yonge

I think it is fairly obvious there will be actually new ports that will be needed. The smaller ports are probably going to have a very good chance. It appears, from his opinion, that the smaller ports will have a great chance of being in -- bringing in the corridors. One recommendation I could make is concentrate on domestic cargo. To date, short sea shipping has not really concentrated on domestic cargo. It's most been -- mostly been concentrating on movement of containers between load and discharge ports which are the main ports. It is 90% of the freight that moves across the highways. It is a huge opportunity, and general opinion, I think, is that port infrastructures are not going to be needed so much because to be able to handle domestic freight, you will be having roll on roll on type of operations rather than lift off lift off which makes for greater attractiveness of smaller ports.

Carl, how do you respond to that or how does short sea shipping fit into the west coast's short sea shipping transportation effort?

C. Sobremisana:

Let me sort of piggy back on Mark's response as well. In our study that are took place particularly initially in the northeast, we found that underutilized ports, ports that are not major operating small ports were looked at in relationship to the port of New York and New Jersey. This particular plan or port was more of a business plan to show an operation, an operational plan that could be viable working with small ports. So, therefore, the opportunities do exist. You the -- the uniqueness of the bridge port experience is there a tie in directly with metropolitan planning organization, which evidently has a great -- freight goods or freight policy on a regional level. So obviously that needs to be an element that has to be considered within the region as well as within major cities that a freight policy existed that a -- allows for an integrated system for short sea shipping to be linked to rail as well as to trucking. Now, farce the west coast is concerned, there have been a number of initiatives that were started. I think we have learned some lessons about that. One of the things we have learned again going back to the studying that we have done in the New York and New England area, we thought a railroad operation was more conducive than lift off which I believe was the month does operandi of most of the operations in the United States. Next year there will be a west coast short sea shipping conference, one of the things that comes to mind also is the opportunities for the use of these - underutilized ports, these new ports are proximity to corridors, I-5, I-10, I-95. Dope sea as well as inland waterways, adjacent highway systems that are basically moving the NAFTA trade -- north and south as opposed to trade going east and west. A lot has to do with geography, a lot has to do with facilities that are available. A lot has to do with the fact that localities have some sort of a freight policy that would be effective in attracting short sea shipping operations.

J. Seplow

Thank you.

Next question - are modifications in the Jones Act being considered to facilitate short sea shipping. I am not sure which one of you would like to answer that.

C. Sobremisana

I will make, take a stab. Right now, we are basically listening to through various mechanisms, SCOOP program, that deals with the two previous conferences we have had. Right now, as far as I know, there is just a listening session as to the Jones Act being a concern.

J. Seplow

Mark, did you have I anything to add to that?

M. Yonge:

I get a little sensitive because I am such a strong supporter of the U.S. merchant marine. They can build competitively priced vessels, but there are things they need and they gave us defined criteria. Coming up with ship designs or same ship designs or series designs gives you that opportunity to do that type of thing, creating enough orders so that ship yards can recover those startup costs on their own to build these types of ships. You know, all of those things are possibilities, and then, of course, going back again to the Title XI program, been underfunded, there is not money there for short sea shipping, and that's going to be a big need, to get it going. I -- I have seen some economic models utilizing very high costs for U.S. flag vessels of railroad design, and the financial models work. Until that is really proven, that it just can't work, well, we should waste any time about modifying the Jones Act, I think we ought to spend all of our time trying to make it work as it is today.

J. Seplow:

Thank you. The next question is what is the effective range, especially minimum distance of short sea shipping operations?

C. Sobremisana:

Okay. I will try to answer that. There are two aspects that I mentioned. One is some previous research that has been done in the United States, if -- and I am thinking the state of Texas has looked at short sea operations. Some of the research done by the University of Texas has shown the density factor, urban density factor is very critical. You can't have large distances where by there is a loss of time as well as the fact that the Market is not as close. So, what we have seen now with the study that was done by the university of New Orleans, is the fact that between highly concentrated urbanized areas, such as the New York/New Jersey area where you have approximately 14 million people and the neck area with congested areas on highways that these are the opportunities, so we are talking probably in the range of 100 to 300 miles, and that just a guesstimate right now. But from the research that's been done so far it looks like 150, 160, 200, 300 miles may be the ballpark range right now.

J. Seplow

Thank you. We will jump ahead to the next question now.

M. Yonge

Jennifer.

J. Seplow:

Mark, did you have anything to add to that?

M. Yonge:

Yes, I did.

J. Seplow:

I'm sorry, go ahead.

M. Yonge:

If I can get back to the slides I had it on it was interesting in of the presentations of the ship yard, they really predicted that of vessels in the future would be in the 30 to 40 knot range which would extend the range Carl is talking about now. Existing vessel capabilities and vessel designs basically only have that kind of capability, and I totally agree with what Carl's studies have shown, but there are ship designs out there today that are being seriously considered that have those faster capabilities, and suddenly it opens up whole new markets of the 300 to 800 to 900 mile capability.

J. Seplow

Thank you. Our next question. Will there be a program to develop a national network similar to interstate highway system to designate natural waterways, canals and regional ports. Mark, did you want to start with that?

M. Yonge

I am going to pass that one off to Carl. I am sure he is familiar with that.

J. Seplow

Okay.

C. Sobremisana:

The best answer I can give to you right now is that there is a freight action committee within the department that is intermodal in nature. It is looking at how freight would be handled. The issue of an integrated system is certainly something that is well appreciated in the secretary's office as well as the maritime administration and the other modes. So it is certainly an interest. I think there is some movement in the legislation, particularly dealing with highway connect ors to ports, for example, that is a start in the direction of integrating the system. So that's the best I can answer right now.

J. Seplow

Thank you. Mark, we have a question specifically for you. What will it take for short sea shipping to be viewed as a transportation alternative in the U.S.?

M. Yonge:

It has got to be viewed as an -- integral part of the transportation system, not as a competitor to any of them, it is going to really be where the truckers will use the short sea ships like a bridge or a toll road, like an -- a true intermodal system such as the piggy back systems that are done with the rails. It is my opinion that in most cases, until you get to that point to where there is -- each of the modes do not have to not look at each other as competitors, but yet as looking at each of the different modes as a way to getting the cargo there regardless of how it is done whether it is truck and ship and rail and truck or whether it is truck and rail and truck or whether it is truck, ship and truck. It is just, that's where it has got to go, it has got to go as a whole, together, before we really get off the ground.

J. Seplow:

Thank you. Next question, you have mentioned that the EU have agreed on short sea shipping involving multiple countries without violation of the laws. Will U.S. also be adopting that stance or looking for a solution through NAFTA? Which one of you wants to take a shot at that?

C. Sobremisana:

Why don't you repeat that. That was a mouthful.

J. Seplow

Okay. It was mentioned that the EU have agreed on short sea shipping involving multiple countries without violation of the laws. Will U.S. also be adopting that stance or looking for a solution through NAFTA?

C. Sobremisana:

Yes, I am really not prepared to answer that question at the time.

J. Seplow:

Mark, do you have a comment on that?

M. Yonge

All I can do is give an opinion. I have no way of talking about policy. Again, to go back to something I said a minute ago, the focus needs to be on let's make it work first. The Jones Act has a very definite purpose of maintaining our international security, our capability to build ships, our capability to crew vessels, and I think that we would be making a horrible mistake of trying to weaken something that is so, absolutely needed to our national security, and so, you know, again, let's focus on making the work -- don't worry about whether you have to have a U.S. flagship. Let's just make it work.

J. Seplow:

Another question for both Carl and Mark. I will let Carl go first. What are the subsidies that the EU has that the U.S. does not?

C. Sobremisana:

To my knowledge, approximately $125 million plus is being spent under the Marco Polo program for supporting what they call nontransportation related activities that would fund such things as infrastructure, waterway development and the like. That's the only knowledge I have, in terms of the actual subsidies that they provide currently.

J. Seplow

Mark, do you have any thoughts on that?

M. Yonge

I have some details I can come and give you, just to give you some idea. What they call the Marco Polo program, mini column published may 7, '03 -- 2002 they put up maximum eligible funding for short sea shipping in different categories here and one was like 887 Euros, another 337 Euros, another 750 Euros for a tulip train, if you want for intermodal rail service, 994,000 Euros for short sea shipping link between an and Amsterdam, another 600,000 Euros for shipping between one place and South Hampton. I haven't added them up but for short sea it is significant. The program covers not only short sea shipping or motor ways of the sea but also provides their whole transEuropean network, train and possibly some truck improvements.

J. Seplow:

Thank you. We have one more typed in question, then we will open up the phone line. Regarding New York and New Jersey activities such as the identification of viable routes, and have there been any attempts to explore and develop short sea shipping services with Canada such as with Halifax?

C. Sobremisana:

I guess I could at least give an initial comment. We have signed a Memorandum of Cooperation with Canada. And they have met with the leader ship of the Department of Transportation and the Maritime Administration, at the highest levels. There will be future conversations concerning how we could share information and beyond that, in terms of actually looking at short sea shipping, I can't comment on that.

J. Seplow

Mark, do you have any comment?

M. Yonge:

No. I haven't been a party to any of the Canadian studies at this point.

J. Seplow:

Okay. At this point, I think we can open the telephone lines and see if there are any questions there.

Operator:

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to register a question, please press the 1 followed by the star on your telephone. You will receive a prompt to acknowledge your request. Your line will then be accessed from the conference to obtain information. If your question has been answered, and you would like to withdraw your registration, please press the 1 followed by a 3. If you are using a speakerphone please lift your hand set before entering your request. One moment please for the first question. Ladies and gentlemen, as a reminder to register for a question, press the 1 followed by the 4. There are no questions from the audio bridge.

J. Seplow

Thank you. Does everybody here have any questions? Okay. I will wait a few more minutes and see if anybody types in or has any questions. At this point, Mark or Carl, are there any other comments that you would like to make?

C. Sobremisana:

For those that are not familiar with short sea shipping I would suggest that you go to the website that was listed on Mark's presentation with the I-95 Corridor. In one of their reports they have a primer on short sea shipping, it gives you a good explanation about what is going on in the United States that I tried to give you an overview on, as well as what is happening in Europe and basically, races the issue from the I-95 Corridor Coalition's perspective.

Operator:

We actually do have questions from the audio bridge. It just takes a moment to get the information from the participant.

Okay . Our first question comes from the line of Jim McCarville. Please proceed with your question.

Jim McCarville, Port of Pittsburgh:

This is kind of a small question, but in the presentation on the comparison of miles and kilometers by barge and train and truck, the barge and the train was actually very close, closer than I usually see in this kind of analysis. But I also noticed the chart had an electric train on it, which is common in Europe. Is that really an effective comparison for United States trains?

C. Sobremisana:

This is Carl. I can't really comment on that.

J. McCarville:

Okay. I am sure you can check that out.

C. Sobremisana:

I will.

Okay.

Operator:

One moment for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Pat Egan. Please proceed with your question.

Pat Egan:

Hi. This is Pat Egan in Oregon, currently working in the Governor's office but in February I am going to the Port of Portland. I think this was a great presentation. It is a lot of what we have been talking about in the local level. My question actually is whether any of the presenters today might be available at some point to make a presentation out here in Oregon, potentially. Obviously I will plagerizing the materials myself at some pointed -- point but I absolutely agree we need to take this mission down to the state level as well. So I just wanted to see if you all have the ability to travel or have resources on the west coast.

C. Sobremisana:

Yes. We have offices in Seattle. Our representative is Lyn Mclellan.

P. Egan:

Yes, I have talked with her.

C. Sobremisana:

Whatever arrangements you could work out or work with her if you don't mind.

P. Egan:

That would be great. Thank you.

C. Sobremisana:

Sure.

Operator:

Our next question comes from the line of Robert Hebert. Please go ahead.

Robert Hebert, Wilbur Smith:

Yes, Carl. This is Robert Hebert with Wilbur Smith.

C. Sobremisana:

Yes.

R. Hebert:

The question I have got concerns funding for the short sea shipping initiative. Is there anything be -- being done to the SCOOP process, the MTSNAC or short sea shipping to look at putting an entitlement program in place to assist states and local governments and others and implementing some pilot programs?

C. Sobremisana

There isn't anything specifically right now, but the maritime traffic force support presenting or putting together a strategic plan for, I believe, the next 10 years. So there may be information that we will deal with that issue.

R. Hebert:

Thank you.

Operator:

Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Richard Nordal. Please proceed with your question.

Richard Nordal:

This will be, actually, somewhat basic, but I think it's key in terms of understanding the dialogue that we are having here. How is short sea shipping really different from some of the efforts that have been traditionally described as barging, or what has been done that was very expensive up through probably the 1950 on some of our river systems and -- unless there is a viable alternative today?

C. Sobremisana:

This is Carl. My initial reaction is that there isn't much a difference, it's just that the conditions of congestion and probably after 9/11 in terms of security in terms of the types of cargo moving on us -- U.S. highways as well. It's really the circumstances that are current today that I think are -- have involved people to look at other alternatives.

M. Yonge:

Carl, were you through?

C. Sobremisana:

Yes.

M. Yonge:

This is Mark. I just want to comment. Someone made the statement one time that for all the times that it didn't work before, or much of the reasons that it works today, the reasons that Carl is just mentioning. Highways had reached the point in many places where they already exceeded capacity. This is a situation to where, if I recall the right statistic, for every one of GDP growth you get 10% increase in transportation requirements. There are just so many issues like that to the point that suddenly, I think what has happened or hopefully what will happen is that short sea shipping activity will not be viewed as a competitor to the truck and rails. You won't wind up with the rate wars that were threatened or would have happened or did happen back then, and suddenly you will just have a new transportation alternative.

Operator:

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as a reminder, if you would like to register a question, please press 1/4.

J. Seplow

We actually have another typed in question here. To what degree is the short sea shipping initiative related to passenger transportation, as most of the discussion has related to freight.

C. Sobremisana:

If you notice, this is Carl -- Carl Sobremisana. It put up on my slide a working definition. There is obviously an awareness that passengers were not included. Within the marine transportation system program that the maritime administration is currently involved in which includes public and private sector representatives as advisors to the secretary. The passenger transportation section is definitely a consideration within the overall transportation system. The short sea shipping is really an appendage to the maritime administration system. So we are looking at the whole thing but within the definition that I gave you, there was an omission.

J. Seplow:

Mark, do you have any comment?

M. Yonge:

I kind of cautiously I could just say that one of my clients is taking that as part of their overall calculation and in their projections, and they are actually taking a very serious look at domestic passenger transportation, as a part of including, you know, as a combination ship. Roll ships that carry passengers and cars.

J. Seplow

Thank you. Do we have any further questions on the line at this time?

Operator:

There are no further questions.

J. Seplow

Okay. At this point, I believe we will close the seminar. Thank you both Carl and Mark for your excellent presentations. Again, if you have further questions, you can contact Carl or Mark directly. Their e-mail addresses are listed on the slide showing. I encourage you to sign up for the freight planning for forum, any questions you may have or to here -- here or to read new ideas. Within the next few days I will be posting a recording of the presentation and sending out an e-mail to let them know when it is available. I will also send out a transcript of the entire seminar within the next day or so. This is the final presentation of 2003, but we do have the first six presentations of 2004 available for registration on the talking freight website, talkingfreight.webex.com. Our next seminar January 21, 1 p.m. Eastern focusing on perspectives of freight transportation users. We will have a speaker from General Motors as well as other companies involved with freight transportation. I just got a note that I will throw out, there will be another short sea conference in April hosted by the JOC at Hilton Head, South Carolina. Again, I think we will close the seminar. If you do have any questions please feel free to e-mail one of the presenters or myself. Thank you and have a nice day.

Operator:

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen, that does conclude the conference call for today. We thank you for your participation and ask that you disconnect the lines

Contact Information

Spencer Stevens
Office of Planning
spencer.stevens@dot.gov
Phone: 202-366-0149/717-221-4512
Carol Keenan
Office of Freight Management & Operations
carol.keenan@fhwa.dot.gov
Phone: 202-366-6993

 

Updated: 03/29/2011
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